Indoor cats
 

First let me say I'm not being antagonistic, I'm just interested in the
(apparent) culture difference between the US & the UK as regards our
feline friends.

With regard to letting cats out: All the cats I know go outside, they
(usually) learn their way back home from their local neighbourhood,
they don't go too far but suss out gardens, wildlife, other cats and
people, and hopefully realise that traffic isn't for playing with.
There's not too many birds in London and no-one seems to care about the
pigeon population anyway. Some get lost, some get hit by traffic (mine
for example isn't allowed out the front to the road, only the back
garden where he doesn't seem to want to climb the fence to escape from
but if he did I'd let him).

It seems natural for a cat to want to venture outside, and to me it's
cruel to keep them inside (unless they're not interested).

It seems that in the US people are much more likely to force cats to
stay indoors, or take them out on a leash (something I've NEVER heard
of over here and to be honest I think people would laugh over here if
they saw a cat on a lead, but fair play for succeeding in training a
cat to do it), or build these enclosure thingies for them, to protect
the wildlife, also I've never seen one over here.

It's interesting, do you think it's a cultural thing? How long have
people in the US been doing these things? Perhaps it's not the general
population, just people in cat groups :) As I say, I wasn't saying
that either way is right, it's just interesting how people do things
differently.

Marcia
Lord Otis's slave and minder

On 17 Aug 2005 11:07:05 -0700, wrote:

First let me say I'm not being antagonistic, I'm just interested in the
(apparent) culture difference between the US & the UK as regards our
feline friends.

With regard to letting cats out: All the cats I know go outside, they
(usually) learn their way back home from their local neighbourhood,
they don't go too far but suss out gardens, wildlife, other cats and
people, and hopefully realise that traffic isn't for playing with.
There's not too many birds in London and no-one seems to care about the
pigeon population anyway. Some get lost, some get hit by traffic (mine
for example isn't allowed out the front to the road, only the back
garden where he doesn't seem to want to climb the fence to escape from
but if he did I'd let him).

It seems natural for a cat to want to venture outside, and to me it's
cruel to keep them inside (unless they're not interested).

It seems that in the US people are much more likely to force cats to
stay indoors, or take them out on a leash (something I've NEVER heard
of over here and to be honest I think people would laugh over here if
they saw a cat on a lead, but fair play for succeeding in training a
cat to do it), or build these enclosure thingies for them, to protect
the wildlife, also I've never seen one over here.

It's interesting, do you think it's a cultural thing? How long have
people in the US been doing these things? Perhaps it's not the general
population, just people in cat groups :) As I say, I wasn't saying
that either way is right, it's just interesting how people do things
differently.

Marcia
Lord Otis's slave and minder

There might be a difference in the percentages of cats kept indoors,
that's all. My cousin who lives in Virginia Waters (England) keeps her
two cats indoors. And let's not forget it's illegal to declaw in
Britain, something that's done quite willingly by many vets in the
States if the owner just asks.

... Steve ..

wrote in message
oups.com...
First let me say I'm not being antagonistic, I'm just interested in the
(apparent) culture difference between the US & the UK as regards our
feline friends.

With regard to letting cats out: All the cats I know go outside, they
(usually) learn their way back home from their local neighbourhood,
they don't go too far but suss out gardens, wildlife, other cats and
people, and hopefully realise that traffic isn't for playing with.
There's not too many birds in London and no-one seems to care about the
pigeon population anyway. Some get lost, some get hit by traffic (mine
for example isn't allowed out the front to the road, only the back
garden where he doesn't seem to want to climb the fence to escape from
but if he did I'd let him).

It seems natural for a cat to want to venture outside, and to me it's
cruel to keep them inside (unless they're not interested).

It seems that in the US people are much more likely to force cats to
stay indoors, or take them out on a leash (something I've NEVER heard
of over here and to be honest I think people would laugh over here if
they saw a cat on a lead, but fair play for succeeding in training a
cat to do it), or build these enclosure thingies for them, to protect
the wildlife, also I've never seen one over here.

It's interesting, do you think it's a cultural thing? How long have
people in the US been doing these things? Perhaps it's not the general
population, just people in cat groups :) As I say, I wasn't saying
that either way is right, it's just interesting how people do things
differently.

Marcia
Lord Otis's slave and minder


It just isn't the same in the USA as it is here. Yes, there is a huge
cultural difference, like declawing being offered at the same time as
speutering presumably because of an assumption that most cats will stay
inside and furniture is king..
BUT. They have the most awful predators there. Cat-eating ones, which,
apart from the renegade fox, we don't have here.
Mountain lions, coyotes, bears are just waiting to snap up your cat. And
big bad traffic like we have never experienced.
At least I think this is the reason that I've learned from this group why
cats are mainly kept inside in the USA. Yes?
Or is it really just cultural? and some of it not necessary, because this
made me think hard.

Tweed

"Christina Websell" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
oups.com...
First let me say I'm not being antagonistic, I'm just interested in the
(apparent) culture difference between the US & the UK as regards our
feline friends.

With regard to letting cats out: All the cats I know go outside, they
(usually) learn their way back home from their local neighbourhood,
they don't go too far but suss out gardens, wildlife, other cats and
people, and hopefully realise that traffic isn't for playing with.
There's not too many birds in London and no-one seems to care about the
pigeon population anyway. Some get lost, some get hit by traffic (mine
for example isn't allowed out the front to the road, only the back
garden where he doesn't seem to want to climb the fence to escape from
but if he did I'd let him).

It seems natural for a cat to want to venture outside, and to me it's
cruel to keep them inside (unless they're not interested).

It seems that in the US people are much more likely to force cats to
stay indoors, or take them out on a leash (something I've NEVER heard
of over here and to be honest I think people would laugh over here if
they saw a cat on a lead, but fair play for succeeding in training a
cat to do it), or build these enclosure thingies for them, to protect
the wildlife, also I've never seen one over here.

It's interesting, do you think it's a cultural thing? How long have
people in the US been doing these things? Perhaps it's not the general
population, just people in cat groups :) As I say, I wasn't saying
that either way is right, it's just interesting how people do things
differently.

Marcia
Lord Otis's slave and minder


It just isn't the same in the USA as it is here. Yes, there is a huge
cultural difference, like declawing being offered at the same time as
speutering presumably because of an assumption that most cats will stay
inside and furniture is king..
BUT. They have the most awful predators there. Cat-eating ones, which,
apart from the renegade fox, we don't have here.
Mountain lions, coyotes, bears are just waiting to snap up your cat. And
big bad traffic like we have never experienced.
At least I think this is the reason that I've learned from this group why
cats are mainly kept inside in the USA. Yes?
Or is it really just cultural? and some of it not necessary, because this
made me think hard.

Tweed


I don't want my cats outside because cars don't stop for them, we have
raccoons (rabid), possums (rabid), rats (rabid) not to mention the fleas,
ear mites, feline leukemia, feline aids.........why WOULD you let your cat
out? Seriously? Do you like paying for vet visits? My female cat, Chloe
is very happy to be where she is; she's SUCH the sweetheart, my male cat is
a devil in cat's clothing. I'd love to let him out just to get the dickens
out of him, but at what cost? You can't have an indoor/outdoor cat without
infesting your house with fleas, mites and ticks or whatever. I just don't
see the point.

kili

"Jennifer" wrote in message
oups.com...
wrote:
snip
It seems natural for a cat to want to venture outside, and to me it's
cruel to keep them inside (unless they're not interested).
snip
It's interesting, do you think it's a cultural thing? How long have
people in the US been doing these things? Perhaps it's not the general
population, just people in cat groups :)


I live in the US, close to DC, and I keep my cats indoors because:

- There are lots of animals out there that may cause physical harm.
Foxes, feral dogs and cats, skunks, etc. Rabies is relatively common
all throughout the mid-Atlantic region. Lyme disease is also very
common in my area.

- There's a lot of native wildlife that I don't think should be
pillaged by my non-native cats, including birds and insects.

- I see it as my responsibility to keep my pets off of other peoples'
property. My choice to keep pet cats should not affect my neighbors -
no pooping in their gardens, no digging up their potted plants, no
antagonizing their pets, etc.

- On a related note, there are people who do not take kindly to having
their yards and gardens disturbed by loose animals, and they can and
will call animal control, or deliberately poison wandering pets.

- There is a ton of traffic everywhere in the DC area. Even if traffic
was slow, it only takes one car to flatten your cat. In fact, one of
my aunts lives in farm country where traffic is light, and she's had
two cats killed by passing cars in the last five years.

When I decided to adopt cats, I took responsibility for their welfare
and their behavior. I provide an interesting, continuously-changing
indoor environment for them (luckily, that often means moving cat trees
around. As far as they're concerned, if it's in a different room, it's
a brand new toy :). I make sure they get a healthy diet and plenty of
exercise, and I'm still debating building them an outdoor enclosure.

Outdoor enclosures really seem to be the best solution. They allow the
cats access to the outdoors, which many seem to enjoy, while protecting
them from most of the dangers.

I don't think it's really cultural; it's just practical. Unless
feeling responsible for your cats health and for not bothering your
neighbors is a cultural thing :)

Also, keeping cats indoors really doesn't seem cruel at all. Seriously
- I know many many indoor cats, and the only ones that seem "unhappy"
(anthropormorphizing, I know) are the ones that seem bored, but indoors
does not have to equal bored.

It really is most common (and recommended) in the US to keep cats
indoors, or at least in outdoor enclosures.

--
Jennifer


Well said, Jennifer.

kili

Christina Websell wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...
First let me say I'm not being antagonistic, I'm just interested in the
(apparent) culture difference between the US & the UK as regards our
feline friends.

With regard to letting cats out: All the cats I know go outside, they
(usually) learn their way back home from their local neighbourhood,
they don't go too far but suss out gardens, wildlife, other cats and
people, and hopefully realise that traffic isn't for playing with.
There's not too many birds in London and no-one seems to care about the
pigeon population anyway. Some get lost, some get hit by traffic (mine
for example isn't allowed out the front to the road, only the back
garden where he doesn't seem to want to climb the fence to escape from
but if he did I'd let him).

It seems natural for a cat to want to venture outside, and to me it's
cruel to keep them inside (unless they're not interested).

It seems that in the US people are much more likely to force cats to
stay indoors, or take them out on a leash (something I've NEVER heard
of over here and to be honest I think people would laugh over here if
they saw a cat on a lead, but fair play for succeeding in training a
cat to do it), or build these enclosure thingies for them, to protect
the wildlife, also I've never seen one over here.

It's interesting, do you think it's a cultural thing? How long have
people in the US been doing these things? Perhaps it's not the general
population, just people in cat groups :) As I say, I wasn't saying
that either way is right, it's just interesting how people do things
differently.

Marcia
Lord Otis's slave and minder


It just isn't the same in the USA as it is here. Yes, there is a huge
cultural difference, like declawing being offered at the same time as
speutering presumably because of an assumption that most cats will stay
inside and furniture is king..
BUT. They have the most awful predators there. Cat-eating ones, which,
apart from the renegade fox, we don't have here.
Mountain lions, coyotes, bears are just waiting to snap up your cat. And
big bad traffic like we have never experienced.
At least I think this is the reason that I've learned from this group why
cats are mainly kept inside in the USA. Yes?
Or is it really just cultural? and some of it not necessary, because this
made me think hard.

Tweed

Piggy-backing on Tweed (lightly, dear, wouldn't want to hurt you):


Another thing, at least in my area... I've seen (and reported) people
who swerve their vehicle in order TO hit a cat, I've seen them drive
onto people's lawns (or sidewalks, or the other side of the road) in
order to run over a cat. Then we've got the ones (in my
neighbo(u)rhood) who enjoy poisoning animals (they've been reported as
well) or shooting them (not just cats).

Where I live the predators are as Tweed listed, then there are the
feral dogs, who do not know how to "kill" correctly, and that is the
worst thing to find (they don't do a kill bite at the throat or spine -
they just rip that animal apart while it's still fighting) and/or hear.
I've seen this, and gotten bitten trying to stop an attack on a little
kid (I managed, baseball bats are wonderful things) with several other
people.

Some of the predators here aren't just interested in cats, they like to
get dogs, ponies, and children too. One is only allowed to kill a
predator if it's attacking a child (or adult), and even then one gets
to deal with fines and punishment for killing "protected" species
(punishment seems to be community service in the few cases I know
about).

Smokie Darling (Annie) - all of my masters and mistresses now prefer
the "great" indoors, so long as they can look outside.

wrote
It seems that in the US people are much more likely to force cats to
stay indoors, or take them out on a leash (something I've NEVER heard
of over here and to be honest I think people would laugh over here if
they saw a cat on a lead, but fair play for succeeding in training a
cat to do it), or build these enclosure thingies for them, to protect
the wildlife, also I've never seen one over here.

I'm in quiet rural Cornwall (UK). Having lost my beloved Kensey to
beheading by a farm implement towed behind a tractor (so much wider than
a car so could catch him waiting in the hedgerow) on the quietest of
country lanes, despite his 8 years of traffic experience including the
occasional very near miss/brush, I swore "never again". Bandit, whom I
got from CP aged around 2 and was experienced in the "out" isn't very
confident and lurks within yards of the house, so moves freely during
the day. Pericles (RB from the FIP virus), Snowball and soon Claudius
was/is/will be harness & flexilead trained and did/does/will go
"walkies" around the garden and even the village as & when they want.
Big red Pericles was a talking point in our community as he led me for
miles around the local footpaths etc.

With our local keen gardeners all being hostile to cats (digging &
pooping) & using lethal slug pellets etc. it isn't only traffic & foxes
that can kill, even in the most peaceful rural area.

So I've adopted the safety-first American approach. Nearly everyone I
talk to knows _someone_ who leash-walks a cat, esp. in towns etc. so it
seems to be getting more common.

If I could resolve border issues with my neighbours I'd try to instal a
cat-proof fence around the whole (small) back garden, but with dividing
lines being theirs & consisting of sheds etc. it's practically
impossible. My "boys" thus get a quieter life than they might like
ideally, but certainly a longer one.

Purrs

Gordon, Bandit, Snowball, Claudius & Raki

Steve(JazzHunter) wrote:
On 17 Aug 2005 11:07:05 -0700, wrote:

First let me say I'm not being antagonistic, I'm just interested in
the (apparent) culture difference between the US & the UK as regards
our feline friends.

With regard to letting cats out: All the cats I know go outside,
they (usually) learn their way back home from their local
neighbourhood, they don't go too far but suss out gardens, wildlife,
other cats and people, and hopefully realise that traffic isn't for
playing with. There's not too many birds in London and no-one seems
to care about the pigeon population anyway. Some get lost, some get
hit by traffic (mine for example isn't allowed out the front to the
road, only the back garden where he doesn't seem to want to climb
the fence to escape from but if he did I'd let him).

It seems natural for a cat to want to venture outside, and to me it's
cruel to keep them inside (unless they're not interested).

It seems that in the US people are much more likely to force cats to
stay indoors, or take them out on a leash (something I've NEVER heard
of over here and to be honest I think people would laugh over here if
they saw a cat on a lead, but fair play for succeeding in training a
cat to do it), or build these enclosure thingies for them, to protect
the wildlife, also I've never seen one over here.

It's interesting, do you think it's a cultural thing? How long have
people in the US been doing these things? Perhaps it's not the
general population, just people in cat groups :) As I say, I wasn't
saying that either way is right, it's just interesting how people do
things differently.

Marcia
Lord Otis's slave and minder

There might be a difference in the percentages of cats kept indoors,
that's all. My cousin who lives in Virginia Waters (England) keeps her
two cats indoors. And let's not forget it's illegal to declaw in
Britain, something that's done quite willingly by many vets in the
States if the owner just asks.

.. Steve ..

I've met many cats outside in Virginia Water, your cousin's definately
in the minority. Of course all the large preditors were killed off by
humans in the UK, hundreds of years ago, if they were still arround the
situation may be different.
--
Adrian (Owned by Snoopy & Bagheera)
A house is not a home, without a cat.
http://community.webshots.com/user/clowderuk

"Christina Websell" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
oups.com...
First let me say I'm not being antagonistic, I'm just interested in the
(apparent) culture difference between the US & the UK as regards our
feline friends.

With regard to letting cats out: All the cats I know go outside, they
(usually) learn their way back home from their local neighbourhood,
they don't go too far but suss out gardens, wildlife, other cats and
people, and hopefully realise that traffic isn't for playing with.
There's not too many birds in London and no-one seems to care about the
pigeon population anyway. Some get lost, some get hit by traffic (mine
for example isn't allowed out the front to the road, only the back
garden where he doesn't seem to want to climb the fence to escape from
but if he did I'd let him).

It seems natural for a cat to want to venture outside, and to me it's
cruel to keep them inside (unless they're not interested).

It seems that in the US people are much more likely to force cats to
stay indoors, or take them out on a leash (something I've NEVER heard
of over here and to be honest I think people would laugh over here if
they saw a cat on a lead, but fair play for succeeding in training a
cat to do it), or build these enclosure thingies for them, to protect
the wildlife, also I've never seen one over here.

It's interesting, do you think it's a cultural thing? How long have
people in the US been doing these things? Perhaps it's not the general
population, just people in cat groups :) As I say, I wasn't saying
that either way is right, it's just interesting how people do things
differently.

Marcia
Lord Otis's slave and minder


It just isn't the same in the USA as it is here. Yes, there is a huge
cultural difference, like declawing being offered at the same time as
speutering presumably because of an assumption that most cats will stay
inside and furniture is king..
BUT. They have the most awful predators there. Cat-eating ones, which,
apart from the renegade fox, we don't have here.
Mountain lions, coyotes, bears are just waiting to snap up your cat. And
big bad traffic like we have never experienced.
At least I think this is the reason that I've learned from this group why
cats are mainly kept inside in the USA. Yes?
Or is it really just cultural? and some of it not necessary, because this
made me think hard.

Tweed

Tweed, you got. You would be surprised even in town there are predators. AND
we seem to have a lot more sicko neighbors.

wrote in message
oups.com...
First let me say I'm not being antagonistic, I'm just interested in the
(apparent) culture difference between the US & the UK as regards our
feline friends.

With regard to letting cats out: All the cats I know go outside, they
(usually) learn their way back home from their local neighbourhood,
they don't go too far but suss out gardens, wildlife, other cats and
people, and hopefully realise that traffic isn't for playing with.
There's not too many birds in London and no-one seems to care about the
pigeon population anyway. Some get lost, some get hit by traffic (mine
for example isn't allowed out the front to the road, only the back
garden where he doesn't seem to want to climb the fence to escape from
but if he did I'd let him).

It seems natural for a cat to want to venture outside, and to me it's
cruel to keep them inside (unless they're not interested).

It seems that in the US people are much more likely to force cats to
stay indoors, or take them out on a leash (something I've NEVER heard
of over here and to be honest I think people would laugh over here if
they saw a cat on a lead, but fair play for succeeding in training a
cat to do it), or build these enclosure thingies for them, to protect
the wildlife, also I've never seen one over here.

It's interesting, do you think it's a cultural thing? How long have
people in the US been doing these things? Perhaps it's not the general
population, just people in cat groups :) As I say, I wasn't saying
that either way is right, it's just interesting how people do things
differently.

Marcia
Lord Otis's slave and minder


It may be partly cultural, but I think it is also at least partly
environmental. There are numerous natural predators in the U.S. (predators
that prey on cats, that is) that apparently are not a problem in England.
We sometimes have problems with acts of deliberate cruelty plus instances of
accidents (such as, ingestion of antifreeze). I can't really address that
last point in a comparative sense with any real accuracy. In addition,
there is a problem that surely occurs in *both* Britain and the U.S. -- that
is, automobiles. It only takes one car at the wrong time to kill or badly
injure a cat.

All of my cats have been very happy as indoor cats, even the one that
started life as a feral cat. He showed a great interest in going outdoors
for about the first year but not afterwards. None of my others have even
shown an interest in going outdoors, although I realize that this is not
true for many cats. I do provide lots of attention, toys, scratching posts,
and cat trees. I personally think that they are happier -- and certainly
more healthy -- than many outdoor cats that have been injured in cat fights
or other ways. I do realize that I may be rationalizing and there is room
for a true difference of opinion, but I also believe that each situation
(indoor vs. outdoor) has some advantages and some disadvantages.

MaryL

My cats --
Duffy: http://tinyurl.com/cslwf
Holly: http://tinyurl.com/9t68o
Duffy and Holly together: http://tinyurl.com/8b47e

On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 19:13:55 GMT, "kilikini"
, clicked their heels and said:

You can't have an indoor/outdoor cat without
infesting your house with fleas, mites and ticks or whatever. I just don't
see the point.

kili


While my cats stay in, for their safety and wellbeing, the above
comment is absurd. Dogs go out every day and don't infest houses with
fleas, mites and ticks, and cats are no different.

My cats can go on the deck or patio with us, but never unattended
outside, and I don't trust the dog behind me not to come over the
fence at them, so close to the house or not at all. Skipjack say not
at all - he will stay in an open doorway.

As far as cultural differences, the US is a very different place from
many other countries. The population (human, feline,, canine, wild
animals) just can't be compared, nor that vicious beast, the
automobile.


--
Janet B
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com
http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/bestfr...bedience/album

On 17 Aug 2005 11:07:05 -0700, yodeled:

First let me say I'm not being antagonistic, I'm just interested in the
(apparent) culture difference between the US & the UK as regards our
feline friends.

With regard to letting cats out: All the cats I know go outside, they
(usually) learn their way back home from their local neighbourhood,
they don't go too far but suss out gardens, wildlife, other cats and
people, and hopefully realise that traffic isn't for playing with.
There's not too many birds in London and no-one seems to care about the
pigeon population anyway. Some get lost, some get hit by traffic (mine
for example isn't allowed out the front to the road, only the back
garden where he doesn't seem to want to climb the fence to escape from
but if he did I'd let him).

It seems natural for a cat to want to venture outside, and to me it's
cruel to keep them inside (unless they're not interested).

It seems that in the US people are much more likely to force cats to
stay indoors, or take them out on a leash (something I've NEVER heard
of over here and to be honest I think people would laugh over here if
they saw a cat on a lead, but fair play for succeeding in training a
cat to do it), or build these enclosure thingies for them, to protect
the wildlife, also I've never seen one over here.

It's interesting, do you think it's a cultural thing? How long have
people in the US been doing these things?

Probably at some point after they got tired of recovering the
run-over, or chewed-up bodies of their beloved cats.

The US is a HUGE country, BTW, and there are a bewildering number of
different civic and geographic variations in the way people live, that
are of course going to effect the way they have animals. People live,
e.g., in midtown Manhattan-- Would you consider that an appropriate
place for cats to wander around? How about near a railroad track, or
an eight-lane highway?

English perceptions may also be affected by the fact that in rural and
suburban areas, you have long completely eradicated the large
predators that would consider your cats to be snacks. Your cats are
the top predators, in many cases. We still have coyotes, bobcats,
bears, cougars, etc.

Cats can live completely full and happy lives completely indoors, from
birth to death. Cats who have never been outside rarely clamor to get
outside.

"Some get lost, some get hit by traffic."

So do children. :P That doesn't mean it's inevitable, and we should
just sit back and let it happen.




Theresa
Stinky Pictures: http://community.webshots.com/album/125591586JWEFwh
My Blog: http://www.humanitas.blogspot.com

wrote:

: First let me say I'm not being antagonistic, I'm just interested in the
: (apparent) culture difference between the US & the UK as regards our
: feline friends.
:
: With regard to letting cats out: All the cats I know go outside, they
: (usually) learn their way back home from their local neighbourhood,
: they don't go too far but suss out gardens, wildlife, other cats and
: people, and hopefully realise that traffic isn't for playing with.
: There's not too many birds in London and no-one seems to care about the
: pigeon population anyway. Some get lost, some get hit by traffic (mine
: for example isn't allowed out the front to the road, only the back
: garden where he doesn't seem to want to climb the fence to escape from
: but if he did I'd let him).
:
: It seems natural for a cat to want to venture outside, and to me it's
: cruel to keep them inside (unless they're not interested).
:
: It seems that in the US people are much more likely to force cats to
: stay indoors, or take them out on a leash (something I've NEVER heard
: of over here and to be honest I think people would laugh over here if
: they saw a cat on a lead, but fair play for succeeding in training a
: cat to do it), or build these enclosure thingies for them, to protect
: the wildlife, also I've never seen one over here.
:
: It's interesting, do you think it's a cultural thing? How long have
: people in the US been doing these things? Perhaps it's not the general
: population, just people in cat groups :) As I say, I wasn't saying
: that either way is right, it's just interesting how people do things
: differently.

I agree with you whole-heartedly. Love of confinement is not something
that comes naturally to any animal.

I do not own a cat, but have a "relationship" of sorts with "stray" one
that visits me almost daily. I give her some food and you might think
that's why she comes, and so would have I if it were not for the fact
that she visited me (actually my 3rd floor porch, I was a just a side
attraction) for 2-3 months before I started feeding her.

Some well-meaning friends have suggested I "adopt" her. Even if I was
tempted for a moment, I have been stopped by remembering the life two
of my friends' cats have, and then watching this one jump the fences,
sniff the entire yards, chase after a real or imaginary mouse, climb up
three floors to sun-bathe, scan three backyards from there and rush
down if she saw something interesting, and many such activities. She
comes inside, wants to be petted, sits on different rugs for 10-15
minutes each, even watches TV now and then, but always wants to return
to outdoors after 1-2 hours.

If you live in an area with lots of wild animals, or in an extremely
urban environment, confinement may make sense. However, in most cases
cats deserve more freedom than we give them. I am happy to hear about
their life in UK.


: Marcia
: Lord Otis's slave and minder
:

In article .com,
wrote:
First let me say I'm not being antagonistic, I'm just interested in the
(apparent) culture difference between the US & the UK as regards our
feline friends.

With regard to letting cats out: All the cats I know go outside, they
(usually) learn their way back home from their local neighbourhood,
they don't go too far but suss out gardens, wildlife, other cats and
people, and hopefully realise that traffic isn't for playing with.
There's not too many birds in London and no-one seems to care about the
pigeon population anyway. Some get lost, some get hit by traffic (mine
for example isn't allowed out the front to the road, only the back
garden where he doesn't seem to want to climb the fence to escape from
but if he did I'd let him).

It seems natural for a cat to want to venture outside, and to me it's
cruel to keep them inside (unless they're not interested).

It seems that in the US people are much more likely to force cats to
stay indoors, or take them out on a leash (something I've NEVER heard
of over here and to be honest I think people would laugh over here if
they saw a cat on a lead, but fair play for succeeding in training a
cat to do it), or build these enclosure thingies for them, to protect
the wildlife, also I've never seen one over here.

It's interesting, do you think it's a cultural thing? How long have
people in the US been doing these things? Perhaps it's not the general
population, just people in cat groups :) As I say, I wasn't saying
that either way is right, it's just interesting how people do things
differently.

Marcia
Lord Otis's slave and minder


My friend, Bubba,

http://www.sonic.net/~claudel/bubba/bubba.html

absolutely refuses to go outside. If I leave the
door open he will go to it and look out, but
won't step thru unless I'm right there and coax
him to do so. I think that the last time he was
outside he has at least one bad experience resulting
in him winding up in the pound, where he found me.

The other day I left the door open and one of
the neighbor's tiny kittens came inside. When
Bubba saw it he went over to check it out and
it arched and hissed at him. Bubba ran off and
hid behind the couch for awhile. All 20Lbs of
him afraid of a little black kitten 1/10 his size...

He's not at all skittish with people though. He's
very outgoing and friendly. I think he believes
that he's a human or something.

Claude

"Janet B" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 19:13:55 GMT, "kilikini"
, clicked their heels and said:

You can't have an indoor/outdoor cat without
infesting your house with fleas, mites and ticks or whatever. I just
don't
see the point.

kili


While my cats stay in, for their safety and wellbeing, the above
comment is absurd. Dogs go out every day and don't infest houses with
fleas, mites and ticks, and cats are no different.

My cats can go on the deck or patio with us, but never unattended
outside, and I don't trust the dog behind me not to come over the
fence at them, so close to the house or not at all. Skipjack say not
at all - he will stay in an open doorway.

As far as cultural differences, the US is a very different place from
many other countries. The population (human, feline,, canine, wild
animals) just can't be compared, nor that vicious beast, the
automobile.



Ha! I've had dogs before that were indoor/outdoor dogs. I'm sorry,
Frontline doesn't cut it. I gave my dog frontline 2 times a month and I'd
still pick about 200 ticks off of him and he was infested with fleas. I
gave him baths weekly. The products don't work. Try to live on Maui and
see if you don't have the same results.

kili

I'm in the UK and my cat is mostly an indoor cat. She is a rescue cat and
was extremely nervous of everything when I first got her.

She also has health problems which mean ongoing medication.

However - we let her out in the back garden when we are at home, or sitting
out there ourselves and she loves it. She mostly sits around out there with
us, or sits sniffing the catmint!

But she's never left alone out there or let out at night etc....

It seems a compromise which she is happy with.

chas

kilikini wrote:
"Janet B" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 19:13:55 GMT, "kilikini"
, clicked their heels and said:

You can't have an indoor/outdoor cat without
infesting your house with fleas, mites and ticks or whatever. I
just don't see the point.

kili


While my cats stay in, for their safety and wellbeing, the above
comment is absurd. Dogs go out every day and don't infest houses
with fleas, mites and ticks, and cats are no different.

My cats can go on the deck or patio with us, but never unattended
outside, and I don't trust the dog behind me not to come over the
fence at them, so close to the house or not at all. Skipjack say not
at all - he will stay in an open doorway.

As far as cultural differences, the US is a very different place from
many other countries. The population (human, feline,, canine, wild
animals) just can't be compared, nor that vicious beast, the
automobile.



Ha! I've had dogs before that were indoor/outdoor dogs. I'm sorry,
Frontline doesn't cut it. I gave my dog frontline 2 times a month
and I'd still pick about 200 ticks off of him and he was infested
with fleas. I gave him baths weekly. The products don't work. Try
to live on Maui and see if you don't have the same results.

kili

kili, dear... do yourself (and rpca) a favour and cut out the cross posting
when you reply. There are some real fanatics on h+b who like to lord it
over everyone, them being "experts" (ha!)

Needless to say, you are correct. I don't know about other folks, but my
dog - Sampson (RB) - was an indoor dog; he only went out to use the potty.

Jill

On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 20:09:11 GMT, "kilikini"
, clicked their heels and said:


Ha! I've had dogs before that were indoor/outdoor dogs. I'm sorry,
Frontline doesn't cut it. I gave my dog frontline 2 times a month and I'd
still pick about 200 ticks off of him and he was infested with fleas. I
gave him baths weekly. The products don't work. Try to live on Maui and
see if you don't have the same results.


well, ALL dogs are indoor/outdoor unles you litter train them! And of
course, dogs are social beings, and keeping them enclosed in a house
24/7 would not be healthy for their behavior.

My dogs don't live outdoors, they live in the house. They spend
varying periods of time outside with me though, and I do not use any
flea/tick preventative products. I'm a big believer that healthy pets
don't tend to attract pests much.

I live in a climate where the summers are hot and sticky and humid.
Mosquitos never actually die here, nor do fleas. I do not have fleas
on my dogs, my cats, or in my house. A rare tick every year or so,
and I do field training with my one dog, so he's in a populated
environment.

200 ticks on your dog? Something is very, very wrong there.

--
Janet B
www.bestfriendsdogobedience.com
http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/bestfr...bedience/album

It's interesting, do you think it's a cultural thing? How long have
people in the US been doing these things? Perhaps it's not the general
population, just people in cat groups :) As I say, I wasn't saying
that either way is right, it's just interesting how people do things
differently.

Marcia
Lord Otis's slave and minder

[Replying to RCPA only]

In most of the parts of the US where I've lived, letting cats outdoors
would have gretly reduced their lifespans. Even in heavily urbanized areas
like Silicon Valley, it was not all that unusual to see coyotes coming
down out of the hills and prowling residential neighborhoods at night.

The part of town we live in now is one of the nicest. There are dogs
running loose once in a while, cars driving by way too fast, and coyotes
and mountain lions coming out of the river bottom. However, our kitties do
love their outside time!

We have a little back yard, completely fenced. I've securely blocked all
of the gaps between fence posts and walks, raised the top of the fence
with plastic netting, and in general made the yard cat-proof. None of the
kitties has ever left the yard since we finished the kitty proofing. And
since they have a safe place, they love to spend time outdoors. They love
to be able to lie in the sun, to chase bugs and lizards, to hunt gophers,
and to have room to run and play with each other.

If I didn't have a kitty-proof yard I wouldn't even dream of letting them
outdoors. It would be a very fast death sentence. The only exceptions are
that Harri Roadcat loves to go for leash walks, Ranger seems to like it a
lot, and Amelia doesn't mind a short leash walk once in a while.

Dan

"jmcquown" wrote in message
...
kilikini wrote:
"Janet B" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 19:13:55 GMT, "kilikini"
, clicked their heels and said:

You can't have an indoor/outdoor cat without
infesting your house with fleas, mites and ticks or whatever. I
just don't see the point.

kili


While my cats stay in, for their safety and wellbeing, the above
comment is absurd. Dogs go out every day and don't infest houses
with fleas, mites and ticks, and cats are no different.

My cats can go on the deck or patio with us, but never unattended
outside, and I don't trust the dog behind me not to come over the
fence at them, so close to the house or not at all. Skipjack say not
at all - he will stay in an open doorway.

As far as cultural differences, the US is a very different place from
many other countries. The population (human, feline,, canine, wild
animals) just can't be compared, nor that vicious beast, the
automobile.



Ha! I've had dogs before that were indoor/outdoor dogs. I'm sorry,
Frontline doesn't cut it. I gave my dog frontline 2 times a month
and I'd still pick about 200 ticks off of him and he was infested
with fleas. I gave him baths weekly. The products don't work. Try
to live on Maui and see if you don't have the same results.

kili

kili, dear... do yourself (and rpca) a favour and cut out the cross
posting
when you reply. There are some real fanatics on h+b who like to lord it
over everyone, them being "experts" (ha!)

Needless to say, you are correct. I don't know about other folks, but my
dog - Sampson (RB) - was an indoor dog; he only went out to use the potty.

Jill


But you do mean you took him out for a walk regularly where he could have a
run off the lead now and again?

Tweed

Christina Websell wrote:
"jmcquown" wrote in message
...
kilikini wrote:
"Janet B" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 19:13:55 GMT, "kilikini"
, clicked their heels and said:

You can't have an indoor/outdoor cat without
infesting your house with fleas, mites and ticks or whatever. I
just don't see the point.

kili


While my cats stay in, for their safety and wellbeing, the above
comment is absurd. Dogs go out every day and don't infest houses
with fleas, mites and ticks, and cats are no different.

My cats can go on the deck or patio with us, but never unattended
outside, and I don't trust the dog behind me not to come over the
fence at them, so close to the house or not at all. Skipjack say
not at all - he will stay in an open doorway.

As far as cultural differences, the US is a very different place
from many other countries. The population (human, feline,,
canine, wild animals) just can't be compared, nor that vicious
beast, the automobile.



Ha! I've had dogs before that were indoor/outdoor dogs. I'm sorry,
Frontline doesn't cut it. I gave my dog frontline 2 times a month
and I'd still pick about 200 ticks off of him and he was infested
with fleas. I gave him baths weekly. The products don't work. Try
to live on Maui and see if you don't have the same results.

kili

kili, dear... do yourself (and rpca) a favour and cut out the cross
posting
when you reply. There are some real fanatics on h+b who like to
lord it over everyone, them being "experts" (ha!)

Needless to say, you are correct. I don't know about other folks,
but my dog - Sampson (RB) - was an indoor dog; he only went out to
use the potty.

Jill


But you do mean you took him out for a walk regularly where he could
have a run off the lead now and again?

Tweed

I once had a house where I could let him run in the fenced yard for a bit.
When it snowed, I went out and dug a trench in the snow for him to be able
to poop and pee. Otherwise he never ran off the leash. I walked with
him... his lead extended to about 20 feet. I have always lived too close to
a busy street to let him run off the lead. He lived 18 years so apparently
I did something the right way :)

Jill

"jmcquown" wrote in message
. ..
Christina Websell wrote:
"jmcquown" wrote in message
...
kilikini wrote:
"Janet B" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 19:13:55 GMT, "kilikini"
, clicked their heels and said:

You can't have an indoor/outdoor cat without
infesting your house with fleas, mites and ticks or whatever. I
just don't see the point.

kili


While my cats stay in, for their safety and wellbeing, the above
comment is absurd. Dogs go out every day and don't infest houses
with fleas, mites and ticks, and cats are no different.

My cats can go on the deck or patio with us, but never unattended
outside, and I don't trust the dog behind me not to come over the
fence at them, so close to the house or not at all. Skipjack say
not at all - he will stay in an open doorway.

As far as cultural differences, the US is a very different place
from many other countries. The population (human, feline,,
canine, wild animals) just can't be compared, nor that vicious
beast, the automobile.



Ha! I've had dogs before that were indoor/outdoor dogs. I'm sorry,
Frontline doesn't cut it. I gave my dog frontline 2 times a month
and I'd still pick about 200 ticks off of him and he was infested
with fleas. I gave him baths weekly. The products don't work. Try
to live on Maui and see if you don't have the same results.

kili

kili, dear... do yourself (and rpca) a favour and cut out the cross
posting
when you reply. There are some real fanatics on h+b who like to
lord it over everyone, them being "experts" (ha!)

Needless to say, you are correct. I don't know about other folks,
but my dog - Sampson (RB) - was an indoor dog; he only went out to
use the potty.

Jill


But you do mean you took him out for a walk regularly where he could
have a run off the lead now and again?

Tweed

I once had a house where I could let him run in the fenced yard for a bit.
When it snowed, I went out and dug a trench in the snow for him to be able
to poop and pee. Otherwise he never ran off the leash. I walked with
him... his lead extended to about 20 feet. I have always lived too close
to
a busy street to let him run off the lead. He lived 18 years so
apparently
I did something the right way :)

Jill


There is definitely a cultural difference between the USA and the UK then.
It would not be seen as acceptable in the UK for a dog never to run off lead
even if only at the weekend on a visit outside town.
A shelter here would not allow a dog adoption if it had to stay on a lead
all its life. They would rightly say you do not have the facilities.

Tweed

"kilikini" wrote in message
. ..


I don't want my cats outside because cars don't stop for them, we have
raccoons (rabid), possums (rabid), rats (rabid) not to mention the fleas,
ear mites, feline leukemia, feline aids.........why WOULD you let your cat
out? Seriously? Do you like paying for vet visits? My female cat, Chloe
is very happy to be where she is; she's SUCH the sweetheart, my male cat
is
a devil in cat's clothing. I'd love to let him out just to get the
dickens
out of him, but at what cost? You can't have an indoor/outdoor cat
without
infesting your house with fleas, mites and ticks or whatever. I just
don't
see the point.

kili


I think you might be overstating this just a wee bit. I live in the US (and
have lived in England as well) and I let my cat out. Of course, we live on a
very large tract of land in the suburbs and he has never strayed off the
lawn, which gives him a couple of acres to roam around. He doesn't have
flea, ticks, or earmites. In fact, he is completely and totally healthy and
happy. My cat is innoculated and always has been. Yes, there are animals
that carry rabies in our town, but he has a yearly rabies shot (recommended
by our vet who thinks it's safer for outdoor cats than the 3 year shot) and
he's such a scardy cat that he would run under the house if he ever came
across anything wild anyhow. He doesn't go out at night ever, he's only out
a couple of hours a day in the warmer months and then asks to come in.

I've kept him indoors when we lived in a less safe place and he rewarded me
by peeing all over the house. You want to know why I let him out? Because I
am sick to death of roaming the house with a blacklight trying to find out
where the damn cat peed. When he goes out, the peeing stops. Period.

Marjorie

"kilikini" wrote in message
...

"Janet B" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 19:13:55 GMT, "kilikini"
, clicked their heels and said:

You can't have an indoor/outdoor cat without
infesting your house with fleas, mites and ticks or whatever. I just
don't
see the point.

kili


While my cats stay in, for their safety and wellbeing, the above
comment is absurd. Dogs go out every day and don't infest houses with
fleas, mites and ticks, and cats are no different.

My cats can go on the deck or patio with us, but never unattended
outside, and I don't trust the dog behind me not to come over the
fence at them, so close to the house or not at all. Skipjack say not
at all - he will stay in an open doorway.

As far as cultural differences, the US is a very different place from
many other countries. The population (human, feline,, canine, wild
animals) just can't be compared, nor that vicious beast, the
automobile.



Ha! I've had dogs before that were indoor/outdoor dogs. I'm sorry,
Frontline doesn't cut it. I gave my dog frontline 2 times a month and I'd
still pick about 200 ticks off of him and he was infested with fleas. I
gave him baths weekly. The products don't work. Try to live on Maui and
see if you don't have the same results.

kili

We don't all live on Maui, nor do we want to. I live in New England, and
although we do have ticks (Lyme Diesease was discovered in Connecticut) and
we do have fleas, I find that Frontline works magnificently well and neither
my dogs or my cat has ever had a flea problem.

"Janet B" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 20:09:11 GMT, "kilikini"
, clicked their heels and said:


Ha! I've had dogs before that were indoor/outdoor dogs. I'm sorry,
Frontline doesn't cut it. I gave my dog frontline 2 times a month and
I'd
still pick about 200 ticks off of him and he was infested with fleas. I
gave him baths weekly. The products don't work. Try to live on Maui and
see if you don't have the same results.


well, ALL dogs are indoor/outdoor unles you litter train them! And of
course, dogs are social beings, and keeping them enclosed in a house
24/7 would not be healthy for their behavior.

My dogs don't live outdoors, they live in the house. They spend
varying periods of time outside with me though, and I do not use any
flea/tick preventative products. I'm a big believer that healthy pets
don't tend to attract pests much.

I live in a climate where the summers are hot and sticky and humid.
Mosquitos never actually die here, nor do fleas. I do not have fleas
on my dogs, my cats, or in my house. A rare tick every year or so,
and I do field training with my one dog, so he's in a populated
environment.

200 ticks on your dog? Something is very, very wrong there.


Nope, common thing on Maui. You just can't get rid of the ticks. I've
sprayed my yard, I've sprayed indoors, one the frontline and you still just
get infested. Everyone's dogs are like that if you have a sandy based soil.
It's just disgusting. And it's everyone's problem. Nothing you can do.

kili

"animzmirot" wrote in message
...

"kilikini" wrote in message
...

"Janet B" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 17 Aug 2005 19:13:55 GMT, "kilikini"
, clicked their heels and said:

You can't have an indoor/outdoor cat without
infesting your house with fleas, mites and ticks or whatever. I just
don't
see the point.

kili


While my cats stay in, for their safety and wellbeing, the above
comment is absurd. Dogs go out every day and don't infest houses with
fleas, mites and ticks, and cats are no different.

My cats can go on the deck or patio with us, but never unattended
outside, and I don't trust the dog behind me not to come over the
fence at them, so close to the house or not at all. Skipjack say not
at all - he will stay in an open doorway.

As far as cultural differences, the US is a very different place from
many other countries. The population (human, feline,, canine, wild
animals) just can't be compared, nor that vicious beast, the
automobile.



Ha! I've had dogs before that were indoor/outdoor dogs. I'm sorry,
Frontline doesn't cut it. I gave my dog frontline 2 times a month and
I'd
still pick about 200 ticks off of him and he was infested with fleas. I
gave him baths weekly. The products don't work. Try to live on Maui
and
see if you don't have the same results.

kili

We don't all live on Maui, nor do we want to. I live in New England, and
although we do have ticks (Lyme Diesease was discovered in Connecticut)
and
we do have fleas, I find that Frontline works magnificently well and
neither
my dogs or my cat has ever had a flea problem.





I'd go back to Maui in a heartbeat. I even asked my veterinarian in Florida
about the Frontline/Advantage products and he admitted that they don't work
on Brown Dog Ticks which afflict the Hawaiian islands so prevalently. It's
just the way it is.

kili

America is obsessed with safety. For example, everything
has to be 'safe for the children'. Political correctness
is another national obsession. Of course, the fact
is that we are a violent, inhumane society.

My 3 cats are indoor only cats and here's why;
My 1st cat (when I was 4), run over by car
2nd cat (I was 16) died of Feline Leukemia
3rd & 4th cats run over by car (I was in college).
And the 4th cat was only allowed outside while someone was watching it....
So my mother got to watch the cat get run over by a car.
Its deplorable how long it took for me to learn this lesson.

About cats wanting to go outside; a heroin addict wants to shoot up too.
I don't think either is good for their health.
And all indoor cats aren't declawed.
And all vets don't agree with declawing cats and some of us out right refuse
to do it completely.

These are just some of my many un-humble opinions.

Oh yea, indoor only cats can live 20+ years (mine are now 14, 14 & 16).
Average life expectance for an outdoor cat (at least in these parts) is 8
years.

(I'll try not to fall off this very tall soap box).

On 17 Aug 2005 11:07:05 -0700, wrote:

It's interesting, do you think it's a cultural thing? How long have
people in the US been doing these things? Perhaps it's not the general
population, just people in cat groups :) As I say, I wasn't saying
that either way is right, it's just interesting how people do things
differently.

I live in a rural area in Western Washington, and my experience has
made me wary. I see freshly killed animals on the road every day,
including a few cats.

My cat, Tweaker, came to be my pet because I found him on the road
after being hit by a car. He had been an outdoor barn cat. Once he
recuperated, it was very clear he had no desire to go anywhere. So, I
keep him inside. Once in awhile I let him outside for a little while,
but only if I am standing right there.

I was taking care of an elderly (14-yo) dog for a friend who got
flooded out of her home. Early this spring, he wandered onto the road
in front of my house while I was inside looking for my car keys, and
someone ran him down and splattered him down 150 feet of pavement. It
was easy to see what had happened. The driver crossed the center line
to hit the dog.

I have a lot of equipment and junked cars here, most belonging to a
tenant who is a mechanic and uses them for his projects. We stay on
top of anything important, but that's about it. My next-door neighbor
here is a yard & garden enthusiast, and he hates me, although we have
never met or spoken. He is also the macho type, and had a sign in his
driveway warning that he will shoot intruders, but I think maybe the
cops made him take it down. He complained to the county, but it
backfired because we aren't doing anything wrong. I'm pretty sure he
ran the dog down. I hear gunshots in his backyard now and then, and I
imagine he might kill any cat or dog that set foot on his property,
especially if he thought it belonged to me.

So that is the cultural milieu in which I am operating.

Charlie

Oh and before I get off my soap box, I forgot, indoor only cats don't need
vaccinations unless they spend time at kennels, etc.
Vaccinations in cats have been shown to cause VASTS (vaccine associated soft
tissue sarcomas) or tumors. Its not clear yet which part of the vaccines
are causing this terrible outcome.
There is a new safer rabies shot for cats, ask your vet about it next time
you go for vaccinations.

I know we get a 3-yr rabies shots for our cats. With 6 cats, that helps!
"Dr.Carla,DVM" wrote in message
news:1PPMe.35682$084.17489@attbi_s22...
Oh and before I get off my soap box, I forgot, indoor only cats don't need
vaccinations unless they spend time at kennels, etc.
Vaccinations in cats have been shown to cause VASTS (vaccine associated
soft tissue sarcomas) or tumors. Its not clear yet which part of the
vaccines are causing this terrible outcome.
There is a new safer rabies shot for cats, ask your vet about it next time
you go for vaccinations.

"Dr.Carla,DVM" wrote in message
news:1PPMe.35682$084.17489@attbi_s22...
Oh and before I get off my soap box, I forgot, indoor only cats don't need
vaccinations unless they spend time at kennels, etc.
Vaccinations in cats have been shown to cause VASTS (vaccine associated
soft tissue sarcomas) or tumors. Its not clear yet which part of the
vaccines are causing this terrible outcome.
There is a new safer rabies shot for cats, ask your vet about it next time
you go for vaccinations.


My vet agrees that the time can be extended significantly for indoor-only
cats, especially those that have previously had a series of rabies shots.
However, he still stresses distemper shots because it is airborne. Do you
agree?

MaryL

I know just to be on the safe side, I have my cats innoculated for all,
since I have a habit of feeding some homeless cats on/off and dont want to
take chances.
"MaryL" -OUT-THE-LITTER wrote in message
news:fhQMe.2585$Ix4.377@okepread03...

"Dr.Carla,DVM" wrote in message
news:1PPMe.35682$084.17489@attbi_s22...
Oh and before I get off my soap box, I forgot, indoor only cats don't
need vaccinations unless they spend time at kennels, etc.
Vaccinations in cats have been shown to cause VASTS (vaccine associated
soft tissue sarcomas) or tumors. Its not clear yet which part of the
vaccines are causing this terrible outcome.
There is a new safer rabies shot for cats, ask your vet about it next
time you go for vaccinations.


My vet agrees that the time can be extended significantly for indoor-only
cats, especially those that have previously had a series of rabies shots.
However, he still stresses distemper shots because it is airborne. Do you
agree?

MaryL

shortfuse wrote:
I know just to be on the safe side, I have my cats innoculated for all,
since I have a habit of feeding some homeless cats on/off and dont want to
take chances.

http://www.aafponline.org/resources/...es/vaccine.pdf

--
Victor M. Martinez
Owned and operated by the Fantastic Seven (TM)
Send your spam he
Email me he

My vet agrees that the time can be extended significantly for indoor-only
cats, especially those that have previously had a series of rabies shots.
However, he still stresses distemper shots because it is airborne. Do you
agree?

In 2000 the AAFP (American Association of Feline Practitioners) recommended
that "following the initial series of vaccinations and revaccination 1 year
later, cats should be vaccinated no more frequently than once every 3
years".
2 years ago I spoke with the AAFP representative at a meeting and he didn't
recommend vaccinating strict indoor only cats (don't even go out on the
porch) due to VASTS. I haven't had any of my cats vaccinated since then.
But, that's just what I decided to do, and it doesn't mean you shouldn't
follow your or your own vet's instincts either.

Needless to say, you are correct. I don't know about other folks,
but my dog - Sampson (RB) - was an indoor dog; he only went out to
use the potty.

Jill


But you do mean you took him out for a walk regularly where he could
have a run off the lead now and again?

Tweed

I once had a house where I could let him run in the fenced yard for
a bit. When it snowed, I went out and dug a trench in the snow for
him to be able to poop and pee. Otherwise he never ran off the
leash. I walked with him... his lead extended to about 20 feet. I
have always lived too close to
a busy street to let him run off the lead. He lived 18 years so
apparently
I did something the right way :)

Jill


There is definitely a cultural difference between the USA and the UK
then. It would not be seen as acceptable in the UK for a dog never to
run off lead even if only at the weekend on a visit outside town.
A shelter here would not allow a dog adoption if it had to stay on a
lead all its life. They would rightly say you do not have the
facilities.

Tweed

I never lived anywhere a dog could run off a lead without encountering a
road and not be subject to being hit (by cars). My Sampson didn't seem to
mind being on a lead. He just peed and pooped and then we went back inside.
He curled up on the couch, chased the tennis ball and was otherwise a tiny
lap-dog :)

Jill

in article , jmcquown at
wrote on 8/17/05 10:27 PM:

Needless to say, you are correct. I don't know about other folks,
but my dog - Sampson (RB) - was an indoor dog; he only went out to
use the potty.

Jill


But you do mean you took him out for a walk regularly where he could
have a run off the lead now and again?

Tweed

I once had a house where I could let him run in the fenced yard for
a bit. When it snowed, I went out and dug a trench in the snow for
him to be able to poop and pee. Otherwise he never ran off the
leash. I walked with him... his lead extended to about 20 feet. I
have always lived too close to
a busy street to let him run off the lead. He lived 18 years so
apparently
I did something the right way :)

Jill


There is definitely a cultural difference between the USA and the UK
then. It would not be seen as acceptable in the UK for a dog never to
run off lead even if only at the weekend on a visit outside town.
A shelter here would not allow a dog adoption if it had to stay on a
lead all its life. They would rightly say you do not have the
facilities.

Tweed

I never lived anywhere a dog could run off a lead without encountering a
road and not be subject to being hit (by cars). My Sampson didn't seem to
mind being on a lead. He just peed and pooped and then we went back inside.
He curled up on the couch, chased the tennis ball and was otherwise a tiny
lap-dog :)

Jill


In Lincoln they have a special Dog park. It's a biiig area where people come
with their dogs and let them off to run that is all fenced in. It's right
down the street. It's extremely popular. I suspect that it is also a "great
place to meet guys/chicks". But people come in droves everyday. I was
wondering if other cities had such a place.