My cat had an accident - I'm sick with worry!

On Jun 1, 2:03 pm, bookie wrote:
On 1 Jun, 15:54, Lis wrote:





On May 31, 6:32 pm, bookie wrote:

On 31 May, 19:35, Lis wrote:

On May 30, 9:14 pm, bookie wrote:

snip

anyway think about the differences in attitudes between us; you have
your cats declawed and have pristine furniture, we have lots of
scratch marks all over our ancient tables and chairs and deal with it
(and have happy cats as a result), says somethign about the different
ways in which we look at our animasl for me

Sweetie-pie, _some_ people have their cats declawed. It's
controversial, most vets refuse to do it in most circumstances, humane
societies and breeders generally include BOTH "must be an indoor cat
only" and "must not be declawed" clauses in all adoption/purchase
contracts.

I have happy cats, that have all their claws, AND mostly undamaged
furniture, because I've always provided appropriate scratching
surfaces for my cats, and taught them where they are.

As usual, when blathering on about the USA, you have no idea what
you're talking about.

Lis

i said 'some' people, i didn't mean all.

so i have no idea what I am talking about eh? so you are sayign that
when i state that some people in the US have their cats declawed that
I am wrong ? are you sayign that noone in the states gets their cat
declawed?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

No, Bookie, you didn't say "some." You said:

"anyway think about the differences in attitudes between us; you have
your cats declawed and have pristine furniture, we have lots of
scratch marks all over our ancient tables and chairs and deal with it
(and have happy cats as a result), says somethign about the different
ways in which we look at our animasl for me"

You presented Americans as callous, furniture-obsessed monsters who
all declaw our cats, in contrast to those decent human beings, the
Brits, who would rather have their furniture wrecked. And you implied
that all our cats are unhappy, too.

You have wrecked furniture. I have intact furniture, AND happy cats,
because I've provided appropriate, attractive-to-them places for them
to climb and scratch and hide. Also toys for them to play with;
they're not bored out of their minds with nothing better for them to
do than wreck my furniture. I bet Sheelagh doesn't have wrecked
furniture, either.

Lis- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

and you have just implied that all my furniture is wrecked and I am
not providing my cats with adequate means to sharpen their claws on or
climb and hide and suchlike, and that they are both bored out of their
minds and so wreck my furniture.

considering that with our animal welfare law now you are pretty much
accusing me of breaking the law and of being a criminal, I would be
careful what you say now as it could well amount to defamation of
character. Especially as what you may be implying about me personally
is not true (but why let that small detail stop you)

sure you want to go down that route?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I was simply mirroring for you what you do concerning my country
pretty regularly, in the vain hope that you might recognize yourself
and rethink your sweeping defamations of an entire country. Waste of
pixels, obviously.

Lis

On Jun 1, 9:12 pm, sheelagh wrote:
On 1 Jun, 19:03, bookie wrote:





On 1 Jun, 15:54, Lis wrote:

On May 31, 6:32 pm, bookie wrote:

On 31 May, 19:35, Lis wrote:

On May 30, 9:14 pm, bookie wrote:

snip

anyway think about the differences in attitudes between us; you have
your cats declawed and have pristine furniture, we have lots of
scratch marks all over our ancient tables and chairs and deal with it
(and have happy cats as a result), says somethign about the different
ways in which we look at our animasl for me

Sweetie-pie, _some_ people have their cats declawed. It's
controversial, most vets refuse to do it in most circumstances, humane
societies and breeders generally include BOTH "must be an indoor cat
only" and "must not be declawed" clauses in all adoption/purchase
contracts.

I have happy cats, that have all their claws, AND mostly undamaged
furniture, because I've always provided appropriate scratching
surfaces for my cats, and taught them where they are.

As usual, when blathering on about the USA, you have no idea what
you're talking about.

Lis

i said 'some' people, i didn't mean all.

so i have no idea what I am talking about eh? so you are sayign that
when i state that some people in the US have their cats declawed that
I am wrong ? are you sayign that noone in the states gets their cat
declawed?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

No, Bookie, you didn't say "some." You said:

"anyway think about the differences in attitudes between us; you have
your cats declawed and have pristine furniture, we have lots of
scratch marks all over our ancient tables and chairs and deal with it
(and have happy cats as a result), says somethign about the different
ways in which we look at our animasl for me"

You presented Americans as callous, furniture-obsessed monsters who
all declaw our cats, in contrast to those decent human beings, the
Brits, who would rather have their furniture wrecked. And you implied
that all our cats are unhappy, too.

You have wrecked furniture. I have intact furniture, AND happy cats,
because I've provided appropriate, attractive-to-them places for them
to climb and scratch and hide. Also toys for them to play with;
they're not bored out of their minds with nothing better for them to
do than wreck my furniture. I bet Sheelagh doesn't have wrecked
furniture, either.

Lis- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

and you have just implied that all my furniture is wrecked and I am
not providing my cats with adequate means to sharpen their claws on or
climb and hide and suchlike, and that they are both bored out of their
minds and so wreck my furniture.

considering that with our animal welfare law now you are pretty much
accusing me of breaking the law and of being a criminal, I would be
careful what you say now as it could well amount to defamation of
character. Especially as what you may be implying about me personally
is not true (but why let that small detail stop you)

sure you want to go down that route?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

This is all going a little bit toooo Far.

If you think I like the sound of my own voice-then you do. Who gives a
monkeys?

If the comment was intended to slight me, then it failed. I don't
feel the need to do the same to you right now......

Um, Sheelagh, no, my qualification in that statement was intended
specifically to make clear that I _wasn't_ including you; that I was
throwing Bookie repeated insults and defamations of my country back at
_her_, and not at every person who happens to be British, and
especially not at you--who doesn't engage in this sort of generalized,
taken-for-granted-as-fact defamation of my country.

Just for the record, I could do with a new 3 piece because the cats
have ravaged it in the side and on the arm too. I would love to say
that was the cats wouldn't damage it, but it is not true. They have
also scratched the hell out of my coffee table legs as well, but so
what, I can replace them, where I can't replace them.

To me, if you declaw your cat, it is cruel. I couldn't consider doing
it, & that is the end of the matter. I don't care if they are chinese,
Canadian or Brits, it is wrong-end of.

Bookie may have confused the issue by now, but no, my cats are not
declawed. And no, I do not approve of declawing. And despite some
confusion that apparently exists on the subject in the UK, declawing,
while legal in most of the US, is also widely disapproved of, strongly
discouraged by humane societies, breeders, and veterinarians. And, in
fifty years of life, I've personally known only two people who have
ever had cats declawed--one cat each, and in those cases, it wasn't to
protect the furniture. I didn't agree with the decision in either
case, but it wasn't furniture they were trying to protect.

OTOH, I do actively discourage it where possible, & I get quite peeved
when they climb on the top in the kitchen;only one particular top, but
It's a no no here. My plate & their feet don't mix...marlbes & jars
work well here.....

I don't think for one moment Bookie"intended" to slight anyone here,
sometimes things just come across the wrong way, & I can see where it
did here. Lis, I "know" she certainly didn't intend to provoke you.(or
anyone else). It is out of hand, & we should know better than to
attack one another in here.

Sheelagh, I'm sorry, but I have to judge Bookie by what she actually
says--especially when she does it over and over again. I'm sure she
didn't intend to "provoke" anyone; I think she takes it for grranted
that her amazingly insulting views of Americans are uncontroversial
fact, and is always surprised (but not daunted in her certainty) when
she's challenged on it or any of her "facts" are disputed.

There are far more important things we could be talking about without
giving in to what is clearly exactly what the trolls want. We are
creating 7th heaven. how about we stop what we are doing & take a long
hard think about what "could" happen here. I'm done with name
calling.
I'd much rather hear Matthews house Rules over again.. they were
hilarious & I hope he shares them with us all. They were ever so good,
but more to the point, so true, that you had to laugh when you got
through them;o)

If Matthew will post them, I'll be happy to read them and laugh.

I think we can do better than this...don't you?

Hey, a lot of the time we do. But do you think you might consider
directing some of this lecture to _Bookie_, and assigning some of the
responsibility to her habitual demeaning and insulting of another
country?

Lis

On 2 Jun, 04:27, Lis wrote:
On Jun 1, 9:12 pm, sheelagh wrote:





On 1 Jun, 19:03, bookie wrote:

On 1 Jun, 15:54, Lis wrote:

On May 31, 6:32 pm, bookie wrote:

On 31 May, 19:35, Lis wrote:

On May 30, 9:14 pm, bookie wrote:

snip

anyway think about the differences in attitudes between us; you have
your cats declawed and have pristine furniture, we have lots of
scratch marks all over our ancient tables and chairs and deal with it
(and have happy cats as a result), says somethign about the different
ways in which we look at our animasl for me

Sweetie-pie, _some_ people have their cats declawed. It's
controversial, most vets refuse to do it in most circumstances, humane
societies and breeders generally include BOTH "must be an indoor cat
only" and "must not be declawed" clauses in all adoption/purchase
contracts.

I have happy cats, that have all their claws, AND mostly undamaged
furniture, because I've always provided appropriate scratching
surfaces for my cats, and taught them where they are.

As usual, when blathering on about the USA, you have no idea what
you're talking about.

Lis

i said 'some' people, i didn't mean all.

so i have no idea what I am talking about eh? so you are sayign that
when i state that some people in the US have their cats declawed that
I am wrong ? are you sayign that noone in the states gets their cat
declawed?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

No, Bookie, you didn't say "some." You said:

"anyway think about the differences in attitudes between us; you have
your cats declawed and have pristine furniture, we have lots of
scratch marks all over our ancient tables and chairs and deal with it
(and have happy cats as a result), says somethign about the different
ways in which we look at our animasl for me"

You presented Americans as callous, furniture-obsessed monsters who
all declaw our cats, in contrast to those decent human beings, the
Brits, who would rather have their furniture wrecked. And you implied
that all our cats are unhappy, too.

You have wrecked furniture. I have intact furniture, AND happy cats,
because I've provided appropriate, attractive-to-them places for them
to climb and scratch and hide. Also toys for them to play with;
they're not bored out of their minds with nothing better for them to
do than wreck my furniture. I bet Sheelagh doesn't have wrecked
furniture, either.

Lis- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

and you have just implied that all my furniture is wrecked and I am
not providing my cats with adequate means to sharpen their claws on or
climb and hide and suchlike, and that they are both bored out of their
minds and so wreck my furniture.

considering that with our animal welfare law now you are pretty much
accusing me of breaking the law and of being a criminal, I would be
careful what you say now as it could well amount to defamation of
character. Especially as what you may be implying about me personally
is not true (but why let that small detail stop you)

sure you want to go down that route?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

This is all going a little bit toooo Far.

If you think I like the sound of my own voice-then you do. Who gives a
monkeys?

If the comment was intended to slight me, then it failed. I don't
feel the need to do the same to you right now......

Um, Sheelagh, no, my qualification in that statement was intended
specifically to make clear that I _wasn't_ including you; that I was
throwing Bookie repeated insults and defamations of my country back at
_her_, and not at every person who happens to be British, and
especially not at you--who doesn't engage in this sort of generalized,
taken-for-granted-as-fact defamation of my country.

Just for the record, I could do with a new 3 piece because the cats
have ravaged it in the side and on the arm too. I would love to say
that was the cats wouldn't damage it, but it is not true. They have
also scratched the hell out of my coffee table legs as well, but so
what, I can replace them, where I can't replace them.

To me, if you declaw your cat, it is cruel. I couldn't consider doing
it, & that is the end of the matter. I don't care if they are chinese,
Canadian or Brits, it is wrong-end of.

Bookie may have confused the issue by now, but no, my cats are not
declawed. And no, I do not approve of declawing. And despite some
confusion that apparently exists on the subject in the UK, declawing,
while legal in most of the US, is also widely disapproved of, strongly
discouraged by humane societies, breeders, and veterinarians. And, in
fifty years of life, I've personally known only two people who have
ever had cats declawed--one cat each, and in those cases, it wasn't to
protect the furniture. I didn't agree with the decision in either
case, but it wasn't furniture they were trying to protect.

OTOH, I do actively discourage it where possible, & I get quite peeved
when they climb on the top in the kitchen;only one particular top, but
It's a no no here. My plate & their feet don't mix...marlbes & jars
work well here.....

I don't think for one moment Bookie"intended" to slight anyone here,
sometimes things just come across the wrong way, & I can see where it
did here. Lis, I "know" she certainly didn't intend to provoke you.(or
anyone else). It is out of hand, & we should know better than to
attack one another in here.

Sheelagh, I'm sorry, but I have to judge Bookie by what she actually
says--especially when she does it over and over again. I'm sure she
didn't intend to "provoke" anyone; I think she takes it for grranted
that her amazingly insulting views of Americans are uncontroversial
fact, and is always surprised (but not daunted in her certainty) when
she's challenged on it or any of her "facts" are disputed.

There are far more important things we could be talking about without
giving in to what is clearly exactly what the trolls want. We are
creating 7th heaven. how about we stop what we are doing & take a long
hard think about what "could" happen here. I'm done with name
calling.
I'd much rather hear Matthews house Rules over again.. they were
hilarious & I hope he shares them with us all. They were ever so good,
but more to the point, so true, that you had to laugh when you got
through them;o)

If Matthew will post them, I'll be happy to read them and laugh.

I think we can do better than this...don't you?

Hey, a lot of the time we do. But do you think you might consider
directing some of this lecture to _Bookie_, and assigning some of the
responsibility to her habitual demeaning and insulting of another
country?

Lis- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

sooooooooooooo sorry you americans take yourselves so bloody
seriously, were you not aware that pretty much the rest of the world
think you as a nation are a bunch of inbred, ignorant warmongerers?
were you not aware of how much the rest of the world laughs at you all
and think you're all morons? ignorance is bliss isn't it? at least we
brits can laugh at ourselves when required, we can take a bit of a dig
at the way we live and admit that some aspects of our society as far
from perfect, can't say teh same about you yanks.

anyway, no law against hating americans and considering them to be not
even worthy enough for me to wipe my feet on? what do you expect when
you reply to people in the tones you have been above

dear oh dear oh dear

On 2 Jun, 04:07, Lis wrote:
On Jun 1, 2:03 pm, bookie wrote:





On 1 Jun, 15:54, Lis wrote:

On May 31, 6:32 pm, bookie wrote:

On 31 May, 19:35, Lis wrote:

On May 30, 9:14 pm, bookie wrote:

snip

anyway think about the differences in attitudes between us; you have
your cats declawed and have pristine furniture, we have lots of
scratch marks all over our ancient tables and chairs and deal with it
(and have happy cats as a result), says somethign about the different
ways in which we look at our animasl for me

Sweetie-pie, _some_ people have their cats declawed. It's
controversial, most vets refuse to do it in most circumstances, humane
societies and breeders generally include BOTH "must be an indoor cat
only" and "must not be declawed" clauses in all adoption/purchase
contracts.

I have happy cats, that have all their claws, AND mostly undamaged
furniture, because I've always provided appropriate scratching
surfaces for my cats, and taught them where they are.

As usual, when blathering on about the USA, you have no idea what
you're talking about.

Lis

i said 'some' people, i didn't mean all.

so i have no idea what I am talking about eh? so you are sayign that
when i state that some people in the US have their cats declawed that
I am wrong ? are you sayign that noone in the states gets their cat
declawed?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

No, Bookie, you didn't say "some." You said:

"anyway think about the differences in attitudes between us; you have
your cats declawed and have pristine furniture, we have lots of
scratch marks all over our ancient tables and chairs and deal with it
(and have happy cats as a result), says somethign about the different
ways in which we look at our animasl for me"

You presented Americans as callous, furniture-obsessed monsters who
all declaw our cats, in contrast to those decent human beings, the
Brits, who would rather have their furniture wrecked. And you implied
that all our cats are unhappy, too.

You have wrecked furniture. I have intact furniture, AND happy cats,
because I've provided appropriate, attractive-to-them places for them
to climb and scratch and hide. Also toys for them to play with;
they're not bored out of their minds with nothing better for them to
do than wreck my furniture. I bet Sheelagh doesn't have wrecked
furniture, either.

Lis- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

and you have just implied that all my furniture is wrecked and I am
not providing my cats with adequate means to sharpen their claws on or
climb and hide and suchlike, and that they are both bored out of their
minds and so wreck my furniture.

considering that with our animal welfare law now you are pretty much
accusing me of breaking the law and of being a criminal, I would be
careful what you say now as it could well amount to defamation of
character. Especially as what you may be implying about me personally
is not true (but why let that small detail stop you)

sure you want to go down that route?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I was simply mirroring for you what you do concerning my country
pretty regularly, in the vain hope that you might recognize yourself
and rethink your sweeping defamations of an entire country. Waste of
pixels, obviously.

Lis- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

and it amuses me that you actually care what i think or say about your
poxy country, that i have actually managed to wind you up to this
point, that you cannot just shrug it off and go 'whatever'!

like i really what you think about blighty anyway, you opinion is not
really worth worrying about since you are only an american and
therefore not important inthe grand scheme of things (do you even know
where my country is? could you point to it on a map? do you know what
a map is? probably not)

"bookie" wrote in message
oups.com...

is it correct that you have the right to have any case heard in a
court of law inthe US? regardless of how outlandish it actually is?
something in your constitution or something, not sure about the
veracity of that statement.

There is supposed to be a law or something preventing frivolous lawsuits,
but apparently it doesn't get used too much. If you go by the strict letter
of the law, even the most stupidest lawsuits have merit. Which is why there
are human judges. To publicly shame stupid people for not even realizing how
stupid they are! But then again, the judge just might want A: to get
publicity by allowing such a stupid case to go forward, knowing there will
be lots of press, or B: have a personal issue with whoever's being sued, or
C: be stupid themselves.

"bookie" wrote in message
ups.com...
On 2 Jun, 04:27, Lis wrote:
On Jun 1, 9:12 pm, sheelagh wrote:





On 1 Jun, 19:03, bookie wrote:

On 1 Jun, 15:54, Lis wrote:

On May 31, 6:32 pm, bookie wrote:

On 31 May, 19:35, Lis wrote:

On May 30, 9:14 pm, bookie wrote:

snip

anyway think about the differences in attitudes between us;
you have
your cats declawed and have pristine furniture, we have lots
of
scratch marks all over our ancient tables and chairs and deal
with it
(and have happy cats as a result), says somethign about the
different
ways in which we look at our animasl for me

Sweetie-pie, _some_ people have their cats declawed. It's
controversial, most vets refuse to do it in most circumstances,
humane
societies and breeders generally include BOTH "must be an
indoor cat
only" and "must not be declawed" clauses in all
adoption/purchase
contracts.

I have happy cats, that have all their claws, AND mostly
undamaged
furniture, because I've always provided appropriate scratching
surfaces for my cats, and taught them where they are.

As usual, when blathering on about the USA, you have no idea
what
you're talking about.

Lis

i said 'some' people, i didn't mean all.

so i have no idea what I am talking about eh? so you are sayign
that
when i state that some people in the US have their cats declawed
that
I am wrong ? are you sayign that noone in the states gets their
cat
declawed?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

No, Bookie, you didn't say "some." You said:

"anyway think about the differences in attitudes between us; you
have
your cats declawed and have pristine furniture, we have lots of
scratch marks all over our ancient tables and chairs and deal with
it
(and have happy cats as a result), says somethign about the
different
ways in which we look at our animasl for me"

You presented Americans as callous, furniture-obsessed monsters who
all declaw our cats, in contrast to those decent human beings, the
Brits, who would rather have their furniture wrecked. And you
implied
that all our cats are unhappy, too.

You have wrecked furniture. I have intact furniture, AND happy
cats,
because I've provided appropriate, attractive-to-them places for
them
to climb and scratch and hide. Also toys for them to play with;
they're not bored out of their minds with nothing better for them
to
do than wreck my furniture. I bet Sheelagh doesn't have wrecked
furniture, either.

Lis- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

and you have just implied that all my furniture is wrecked and I am
not providing my cats with adequate means to sharpen their claws on
or
climb and hide and suchlike, and that they are both bored out of
their
minds and so wreck my furniture.

considering that with our animal welfare law now you are pretty much
accusing me of breaking the law and of being a criminal, I would be
careful what you say now as it could well amount to defamation of
character. Especially as what you may be implying about me personally
is not true (but why let that small detail stop you)

sure you want to go down that route?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

This is all going a little bit toooo Far.

If you think I like the sound of my own voice-then you do. Who gives a
monkeys?

If the comment was intended to slight me, then it failed. I don't
feel the need to do the same to you right now......

Um, Sheelagh, no, my qualification in that statement was intended
specifically to make clear that I _wasn't_ including you; that I was
throwing Bookie repeated insults and defamations of my country back at
_her_, and not at every person who happens to be British, and
especially not at you--who doesn't engage in this sort of generalized,
taken-for-granted-as-fact defamation of my country.

Just for the record, I could do with a new 3 piece because the cats
have ravaged it in the side and on the arm too. I would love to say
that was the cats wouldn't damage it, but it is not true. They have
also scratched the hell out of my coffee table legs as well, but so
what, I can replace them, where I can't replace them.

To me, if you declaw your cat, it is cruel. I couldn't consider doing
it, & that is the end of the matter. I don't care if they are chinese,
Canadian or Brits, it is wrong-end of.

Bookie may have confused the issue by now, but no, my cats are not
declawed. And no, I do not approve of declawing. And despite some
confusion that apparently exists on the subject in the UK, declawing,
while legal in most of the US, is also widely disapproved of, strongly
discouraged by humane societies, breeders, and veterinarians. And, in
fifty years of life, I've personally known only two people who have
ever had cats declawed--one cat each, and in those cases, it wasn't to
protect the furniture. I didn't agree with the decision in either
case, but it wasn't furniture they were trying to protect.

OTOH, I do actively discourage it where possible, & I get quite peeved
when they climb on the top in the kitchen;only one particular top, but
It's a no no here. My plate & their feet don't mix...marlbes & jars
work well here.....

I don't think for one moment Bookie"intended" to slight anyone here,
sometimes things just come across the wrong way, & I can see where it
did here. Lis, I "know" she certainly didn't intend to provoke you.(or
anyone else). It is out of hand, & we should know better than to
attack one another in here.

Sheelagh, I'm sorry, but I have to judge Bookie by what she actually
says--especially when she does it over and over again. I'm sure she
didn't intend to "provoke" anyone; I think she takes it for grranted
that her amazingly insulting views of Americans are uncontroversial
fact, and is always surprised (but not daunted in her certainty) when
she's challenged on it or any of her "facts" are disputed.

There are far more important things we could be talking about without
giving in to what is clearly exactly what the trolls want. We are
creating 7th heaven. how about we stop what we are doing & take a long
hard think about what "could" happen here. I'm done with name
calling.
I'd much rather hear Matthews house Rules over again.. they were
hilarious & I hope he shares them with us all. They were ever so good,
but more to the point, so true, that you had to laugh when you got
through them;o)

If Matthew will post them, I'll be happy to read them and laugh.

I think we can do better than this...don't you?

Hey, a lot of the time we do. But do you think you might consider
directing some of this lecture to _Bookie_, and assigning some of the
responsibility to her habitual demeaning and insulting of another
country?

Lis- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

sooooooooooooo sorry you americans take yourselves so bloody
seriously, were you not aware that pretty much the rest of the world
think you as a nation are a bunch of inbred, ignorant warmongerers?
were you not aware of how much the rest of the world laughs at you all
and think you're all morons? ignorance is bliss isn't it? at least we
brits can laugh at ourselves when required, we can take a bit of a dig
at the way we live and admit that some aspects of our society as far
from perfect, can't say teh same about you yanks.

anyway, no law against hating americans and considering them to be not
even worthy enough for me to wipe my feet on? what do you expect when
you reply to people in the tones you have been above

dear oh dear oh dear


Thanks Bookie I am an American even more than that I am part Native
American

On 3 Jun, 00:44, "Matthew" wrote:
"bookie" wrote in message

ups.com...





On 2 Jun, 04:27, Lis wrote:
On Jun 1, 9:12 pm, sheelagh wrote:

On 1 Jun, 19:03, bookie wrote:

On 1 Jun, 15:54, Lis wrote:

On May 31, 6:32 pm, bookie wrote:

On 31 May, 19:35, Lis wrote:

On May 30, 9:14 pm, bookie wrote:

snip

anyway think about the differences in attitudes between us;
you have
your cats declawed and have pristine furniture, we have lots
of
scratch marks all over our ancient tables and chairs and deal
with it
(and have happy cats as a result), says somethign about the
different
ways in which we look at our animasl for me

Sweetie-pie, _some_ people have their cats declawed. It's
controversial, most vets refuse to do it in most circumstances,
humane
societies and breeders generally include BOTH "must be an
indoor cat
only" and "must not be declawed" clauses in all
adoption/purchase
contracts.

I have happy cats, that have all their claws, AND mostly
undamaged
furniture, because I've always provided appropriate scratching
surfaces for my cats, and taught them where they are.

As usual, when blathering on about the USA, you have no idea
what
you're talking about.

Lis

i said 'some' people, i didn't mean all.

so i have no idea what I am talking about eh? so you are sayign
that
when i state that some people in the US have their cats declawed
that
I am wrong ? are you sayign that noone in the states gets their
cat
declawed?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

No, Bookie, you didn't say "some." You said:

"anyway think about the differences in attitudes between us; you
have
your cats declawed and have pristine furniture, we have lots of
scratch marks all over our ancient tables and chairs and deal with
it
(and have happy cats as a result), says somethign about the
different
ways in which we look at our animasl for me"

You presented Americans as callous, furniture-obsessed monsters who
all declaw our cats, in contrast to those decent human beings, the
Brits, who would rather have their furniture wrecked. And you
implied
that all our cats are unhappy, too.

You have wrecked furniture. I have intact furniture, AND happy
cats,
because I've provided appropriate, attractive-to-them places for
them
to climb and scratch and hide. Also toys for them to play with;
they're not bored out of their minds with nothing better for them
to
do than wreck my furniture. I bet Sheelagh doesn't have wrecked
furniture, either.

Lis- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

and you have just implied that all my furniture is wrecked and I am
not providing my cats with adequate means to sharpen their claws on
or
climb and hide and suchlike, and that they are both bored out of
their
minds and so wreck my furniture.

considering that with our animal welfare law now you are pretty much
accusing me of breaking the law and of being a criminal, I would be
careful what you say now as it could well amount to defamation of
character. Especially as what you may be implying about me personally
is not true (but why let that small detail stop you)

sure you want to go down that route?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

This is all going a little bit toooo Far.

If you think I like the sound of my own voice-then you do. Who gives a
monkeys?

If the comment was intended to slight me, then it failed. I don't
feel the need to do the same to you right now......

Um, Sheelagh, no, my qualification in that statement was intended
specifically to make clear that I _wasn't_ including you; that I was
throwing Bookie repeated insults and defamations of my country back at
_her_, and not at every person who happens to be British, and
especially not at you--who doesn't engage in this sort of generalized,
taken-for-granted-as-fact defamation of my country.

Just for the record, I could do with a new 3 piece because the cats
have ravaged it in the side and on the arm too. I would love to say
that was the cats wouldn't damage it, but it is not true. They have
also scratched the hell out of my coffee table legs as well, but so
what, I can replace them, where I can't replace them.

To me, if you declaw your cat, it is cruel. I couldn't consider doing
it, & that is the end of the matter. I don't care if they are chinese,
Canadian or Brits, it is wrong-end of.

Bookie may have confused the issue by now, but no, my cats are not
declawed. And no, I do not approve of declawing. And despite some
confusion that apparently exists on the subject in the UK, declawing,
while legal in most of the US, is also widely disapproved of, strongly
discouraged by humane societies, breeders, and veterinarians. And, in
fifty years of life, I've personally known only two people who have
ever had cats declawed--one cat each, and in those cases, it wasn't to
protect the furniture. I didn't agree with the decision in either
case, but it wasn't furniture they were trying to protect.

OTOH, I do actively discourage it where possible, & I get quite peeved
when they climb on the top in the kitchen;only one particular top, but
It's a no no here. My plate & their feet don't mix...marlbes & jars
work well here.....

I don't think for one moment Bookie"intended" to slight anyone here,
sometimes things just come across the wrong way, & I can see where it
did here. Lis, I "know" she certainly didn't intend to provoke you.(or
anyone else). It is out of hand, & we should know better than to
attack one another in here.

Sheelagh, I'm sorry, but I have to judge Bookie by what she actually
says--especially when she does it over and over again. I'm sure she
didn't intend to "provoke" anyone; I think she takes it for grranted
that her amazingly insulting views of Americans are uncontroversial
fact, and is always surprised (but not daunted in her certainty) when
she's challenged on it or any of her "facts" are disputed.

There are far more important things we could be talking about without
giving in to what is clearly exactly what the trolls want. We are
creating 7th heaven. how about we stop what we are doing & take a long
hard think about what "could" happen here. I'm done with name
calling.
I'd much rather hear Matthews house Rules over again.. they were
hilarious & I hope he shares them with us all. They were ever so good,
but more to the point, so true, that you had to laugh when you got
through them;o)

If Matthew will post them, I'll be happy to read them and laugh.

I think we can do better than this...don't you?

Hey, a lot of the time we do. But do you think you might consider
directing some of this lecture to _Bookie_, and assigning some of the
responsibility to her habitual demeaning and insulting of another
country?

Lis- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

sooooooooooooo sorry you americans take yourselves so bloody
seriously, were you not aware that pretty much the rest of the world
think you as a nation are a bunch of inbred, ignorant warmongerers?
were you not aware of how much the rest of the world laughs at you all
and think you're all morons? ignorance is bliss isn't it? at least we
brits can laugh at ourselves when required, we can take a bit of a dig
at the way we live and admit that some aspects of our society as far
from perfect, can't say teh same about you yanks.

anyway, no law against hating americans and considering them to be not
even worthy enough for me to wipe my feet on? what do you expect when
you reply to people in the tones you have been above

dear oh dear oh dear

Thanks Bookie I am an American even more than that I am part Native
American- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text

"Lilah Morgan" wrote in message
hlink.net...
"sheelagh" wrote in message
ups.com...

Bookie isn't the only one who thinks this way. I find it rather hard
to understand as well, but then again, I live in the UK too..

I know the UK is more considerate when it comes to animals than the US is.
A
friend of mine in Liverpool adopted a kitten last year, and here in the
States, at animal shelters you basically just pay like $50 and you get to
take the animal home.
snip

This is absolutely *not true.* There are some shelters that do that, but
there are many more that have policies designed to protect the welfare of
pets that are adopted. Please check for my message in this thread where I
described the process when I adopted Duffy -- definitely *not* what you
described! I adopted Duffy from a shelter about 30-35 miles from my home.
Our local shelter is often criticized (almost to the point of abuse) because
they will *not* do as you claimed. Many people are almost enraged because
they have fairly stringent adoption policies and some people seem to think
that "any home is better than euthanasia" (where clearly that is often not
the case).

So, it's true that some shelters are not worthy of the name "shelter," but
you simply cannot lump all US facilities together into one bundle (and I
would expect that's true of most countries).

MaryL

"MaryL" -OUT-THE-LITTER wrote in message
...

This is absolutely *not true.* There are some shelters that do that, but
there are many more that have policies designed to protect the welfare of
pets that are adopted. Please check for my message in this thread where I
described the process when I adopted Duffy -- definitely *not* what you
described! I adopted Duffy from a shelter about 30-35 miles from my home.
Our local shelter is often criticized (almost to the point of abuse)
because
they will *not* do as you claimed. Many people are almost enraged because
they have fairly stringent adoption policies and some people seem to think
that "any home is better than euthanasia" (where clearly that is often not
the case).

So, it's true that some shelters are not worthy of the name "shelter," but
you simply cannot lump all US facilities together into one bundle (and I
would expect that's true of most countries).

MaryL

For the record, I am American citizen. And I have lived in 3 different
states where that's how we adopted our pets. Granted it's been well over 10
years since we've adopted a pet from a shelter(all our dogs now have come to
us because people we knew wouldn't fix their pets and had litters as a
result), so the rules indeed may have changed, but I am speaking from
legitimate experience.

"Lilah Morgan" wrote in message
link.net...
"MaryL" -OUT-THE-LITTER wrote in message
...

This is absolutely *not true.* There are some shelters that do that, but
there are many more that have policies designed to protect the welfare of
pets that are adopted. Please check for my message in this thread where
I
described the process when I adopted Duffy -- definitely *not* what you
described! I adopted Duffy from a shelter about 30-35 miles from my
home.
Our local shelter is often criticized (almost to the point of abuse)
because
they will *not* do as you claimed. Many people are almost enraged
because
they have fairly stringent adoption policies and some people seem to
think
that "any home is better than euthanasia" (where clearly that is often
not
the case).

So, it's true that some shelters are not worthy of the name "shelter,"
but
you simply cannot lump all US facilities together into one bundle (and I
would expect that's true of most countries).

MaryL

For the record, I am American citizen. And I have lived in 3 different
states where that's how we adopted our pets. Granted it's been well over
10
years since we've adopted a pet from a shelter(all our dogs now have come
to
us because people we knew wouldn't fix their pets and had litters as a
result), so the rules indeed may have changed, but I am speaking from
legitimate experience.



I wasn't questioning a statement that *some* shelters may follow that
policy, and I wasn't concentrating on citizenship (although I assumed that
you are a US citizen or at least live here). My concern is that you have
taken your experience and seem to assum that *all* shelters operate that
way. My experience has been exactly the opposite -- but that does not mean
that all shelters are well run, it only means that my experience has not
been the same as yours. Moreover, ten years would not make the difference.
What makes the difference is that there are many thousands of shelters in
the US, and there are many variations among them.

MaryL