Cat not good - time for euthanasia?

Our cat, Neil, is now nearly 12 years old and has been not well for
about 6 months.

6 months ago we noticed that his abdomen was beginning to swell up
quite a bit so we took him to the vets. Turns out his abdomen was full
of fluid and possibly his liver was slightly large. Blood tests were
done for liver problems, cancer, thyroid, and all turned up negative.
We had x-rays and scans done but nothing could be found (due possibly
to the fluid).

At the time (and still is), he was very hungry all the time and gulped
down his food. Also, he was always wanting more and more food. At the
time, we thought he has still pretty much happy though.

As the months have gone on the vets have tried him on increasing doses
of steroids to try and get rid of his fluid but nothing has worked. If
anything hes got even more swollen.

Hes now having a little difficulty gettung around and wont fit through
the catflap. Also, he seems to be getting more hungry and increasingly
anxious about food.

Also, he seems to be getting lots and lots of diarhoea now which is
happening every day. Also, hes not making it outside and is doing it in
the house (whihc is not cool with a young toddler in the house).
Generally he seems a bit unhappy. He wont leave his food area and wont
go outside.

Vet has suggested maybe an exploratory operation but I'm not sure about
that idea.

He does seem to be getting steadily more unhappy so I'm not sure if its
time for him to go quietly rather than put up with more.

Anyone got any comments?

"paulfoel" wrote in message
ups.com...
Our cat, Neil, is now nearly 12 years old and has been not well for
about 6 months.

6 months ago we noticed that his abdomen was beginning to swell up
quite a bit so we took him to the vets. Turns out his abdomen was full
of fluid and possibly his liver was slightly large. Blood tests were
done for liver problems, cancer, thyroid, and all turned up negative.
We had x-rays and scans done but nothing could be found (due possibly
to the fluid).

At the time (and still is), he was very hungry all the time and gulped
down his food. Also, he was always wanting more and more food. At the
time, we thought he has still pretty much happy though.

As the months have gone on the vets have tried him on increasing doses
of steroids to try and get rid of his fluid but nothing has worked. If
anything hes got even more swollen.

Hes now having a little difficulty gettung around and wont fit through
the catflap. Also, he seems to be getting more hungry and increasingly
anxious about food.

Also, he seems to be getting lots and lots of diarhoea now which is
happening every day. Also, hes not making it outside and is doing it in
the house (whihc is not cool with a young toddler in the house).
Generally he seems a bit unhappy. He wont leave his food area and wont
go outside.

Vet has suggested maybe an exploratory operation but I'm not sure about
that idea.

He does seem to be getting steadily more unhappy so I'm not sure if its
time for him to go quietly rather than put up with more.

Anyone got any comments?


If I were in your place I would take him to another vet before I made
any decisions. You haven't even gotten a diagnosis from your vet.

As the months have gone on the vets
have tried him on increasing doses of
steroids to try and get rid of his fluid but
nothing has worked. If anything hes got
even more swollen.
Hes now having a little difficulty gettung
around and wont fit through the catflap.
Also, he seems to be getting more hungry
and increasingly anxious about food.

Since steroids cause fluid retention, I don't know why your vet would
think this is a good program for eliminating the extra fluid. A
medication such as Lasix is an appropriate drug for this use. Steroids
also stimluate the appetite, which would explain your cat's anxiousness
about food.
You need to find another vet ASAP, preferably an internal medicine
specialist, and get a diagnosis and proper treatment plan. The vet you
are using now is obviously clueless and is doing more harm than good.

Megan



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I see scans mentioned but not what Did they do an ultra sound since
nothing could be seen because of the fluid or nothing was seen on the x-ray
I might be time for another x-ray with a little more slow paced tech
getting in all the angles. I won't say anything about money but is there
a animal surgical center in your area It might be in the cats' best
interest to take him to him there where more than one vet can take a look
and they usually have the proper equipment to do a diagnoses

I am assuming the cat's stool is ok the abdomen is not sore to the touch or
the cat is pain when moving

cybercat wrote:
"paulfoel" wrote in message
ups.com...

Our cat, Neil, is now nearly 12 years old and has been not well for
about 6 months.

6 months ago we noticed that his abdomen was beginning to swell up
quite a bit so we took him to the vets. Turns out his abdomen was full
of fluid and possibly his liver was slightly large. Blood tests were
done for liver problems, cancer, thyroid, and all turned up negative.
We had x-rays and scans done but nothing could be found (due possibly
to the fluid).

At the time (and still is), he was very hungry all the time and gulped
down his food. Also, he was always wanting more and more food. At the
time, we thought he has still pretty much happy though.

As the months have gone on the vets have tried him on increasing doses
of steroids to try and get rid of his fluid but nothing has worked. If
anything hes got even more swollen.

Hes now having a little difficulty gettung around and wont fit through
the catflap. Also, he seems to be getting more hungry and increasingly
anxious about food.

Also, he seems to be getting lots and lots of diarhoea now which is
happening every day. Also, hes not making it outside and is doing it in
the house (whihc is not cool with a young toddler in the house).
Generally he seems a bit unhappy. He wont leave his food area and wont
go outside.

Vet has suggested maybe an exploratory operation but I'm not sure about
that idea.

He does seem to be getting steadily more unhappy so I'm not sure if its
time for him to go quietly rather than put up with more.

Anyone got any comments?



If I were in your place I would take him to another vet before I made
any decisions. You haven't even gotten a diagnosis from your vet.



Seek a 2nd opinion from another vet.

paulfoel wrote:

Our cat, Neil, is now nearly 12 years old and has been not well for
about 6 months.

6 months ago we noticed that his abdomen was beginning to swell up
quite a bit so we took him to the vets. Turns out his abdomen was full
of fluid and possibly his liver was slightly large. Blood tests were
done for liver problems, cancer, thyroid, and all turned up negative.
We had x-rays and scans done but nothing could be found (due possibly
to the fluid).

At the time (and still is), he was very hungry all the time and gulped
down his food. Also, he was always wanting more and more food. At the
time, we thought he has still pretty much happy though.

As the months have gone on the vets have tried him on increasing doses
of steroids to try and get rid of his fluid but nothing has worked. If
anything hes got even more swollen.

Hes now having a little difficulty gettung around and wont fit through
the catflap. Also, he seems to be getting more hungry and increasingly
anxious about food.

Also, he seems to be getting lots and lots of diarhoea now which is
happening every day. Also, hes not making it outside and is doing it in
the house (whihc is not cool with a young toddler in the house).
Generally he seems a bit unhappy. He wont leave his food area and wont
go outside.

Vet has suggested maybe an exploratory operation but I'm not sure about
that idea.

He does seem to be getting steadily more unhappy so I'm not sure if its
time for him to go quietly rather than put up with more.

Anyone got any comments?



No way would I let that vet do exploratory surgery. Get a second opinion
before making any decisions.

"paulfoel" wrote in message
ups.com...
Our cat, Neil, is now nearly 12 years old and has been not well for
about 6 months.

6 months ago we noticed that his abdomen was beginning to swell up
quite a bit so we took him to the vets. Turns out his abdomen was full
of fluid


Did the vet draw a sample of the fluid for analysis? That's the *first* and
most important step. There are several types of fluid that are produced by
different causes. So, determining the type of fluid might help determine
the cause that's producing the fluid or at least narrow down the
possibilities.

Draining the fluid from his abdomen (abdomenocentesis) will make him feel
much better.



and possibly his liver was slightly large. Blood tests were
done for liver problems, cancer, thyroid, and all turned up negative.

Were his serum albumin levels normal? Very important.


We had x-rays and scans


By "scans", do you mean ultrasounds? If so, was his heart scanned
(echocardiogram)? If not I suggest getting an echocardiogram. Heart
disease can produce fluid while the bloodwork is normal.



done but nothing could be found (due possibly
to the fluid).


Did the vet tell you that? Fluid hampers x-rays but it *enhances* sonograms
by producing an "acoustic window". In fact, the cat's body can be
positioned to make the fluid move into different areas to produce better
views.



At the time (and still is), he was very hungry all the time and gulped
down his food. Also, he was always wanting more and more food. At the
time, we thought he has still pretty much happy though.

As the months have gone on the vets have tried him on increasing doses
of steroids to try and get rid of his fluid but nothing has worked. If
anything hes got even more swollen.


Without having the fluid analyzed, steroids are a *very* bad idea. I
strongly suggest you find another vet *as soon possible*. Be sure to get a
copy of *all* your cat's medical records.




Hes now having a little difficulty gettung around and wont fit through
the catflap. Also, he seems to be getting more hungry and increasingly
anxious about food.

The steroids are probably increasing his appetite- that's one of the side
effects that steroids produce in cats.



Also, he seems to be getting lots and lots of diarhoea now which is
happening every day. Also, hes not making it outside and is doing it in
the house (whihc is not cool with a young toddler in the house).
Generally he seems a bit unhappy. He wont leave his food area and wont
go outside.

Vet has suggested maybe an exploratory operation but I'm not sure about
that idea.


He shouldn't even consider exploratory surgery without having the fluid
analyzed! *Please* find another vet *ASAP*.




He does seem to be getting steadily more unhappy so I'm not sure if its
time for him to go quietly rather than put up with more.

Please don't even consider euthanasia until you get a definitive diagnosis.
His condition is probably treatable under the care of a competent vet- which
your present vet *is not*.




Anyone got any comments?

I would keep him indoors at all times until his condition resolves.


Please find another vet and have the fluid analyzed and order an
echocardiogram. While the vet is drawing fluid for analysis, he can remove
most of the fluid which will make your cat much more comfortable.

If you need help locating a board-certified veterinary internist in your
area, please go to: http://www.acvim.org/Kittleson/search.htm and do a
search for an internal medicine Diplomate/Specialist in your area. American
College of Veterinary Internal Medicine Diplomates are about the best there
is.


If you can't find an ACVIM specialist in your area, my second choice would
be an ABVP Diplomate/Feline Specialist (American Board of Veterinary
Practitioners). Go to http://www.abvp.com/finddiplomate.aspx


Please do not delay in finding another vet.

Best of luck,

Phil

Phil P. wrote:

Please find another vet and have the fluid analyzed and order an
echocardiogram. While the vet is drawing fluid for analysis, he can remove
most of the fluid which will make your cat much more comfortable.

If you need help locating a board-certified veterinary internist in your
area, please go to: http://www.acvim.org/Kittleson/search.htm and do a
search for an internal medicine Diplomate/Specialist in your area. American
College of Veterinary Internal Medicine Diplomates are about the best there
is.


If you can't find an ACVIM specialist in your area, my second choice would
be an ABVP Diplomate/Feline Specialist (American Board of Veterinary
Practitioners). Go to http://www.abvp.com/finddiplomate.aspx

The first URL does not work so went with the second. In my state of
Pennsylvania there are only 5 listed for ANY category of animal. And
none in the biggest city of Philadelphia which has the Penn Vet School.
I'm shocked.

http://www.acvim.org/uploadedFiles/p...y/SAIM_Geo.pdf

the above lists all the diplomates with ACVIM, small animals, internal
medicine.
and now here there is a huge amount from Philly. what gives?

Is ACVIM more popular and ABVP a rival org? I've noticed for people
rival diplomate ratings, the older American College of Physicians verus
the whatever. And DOs vs MDs with their board ratings. Bunch of quacks.

This is what I did for treating a parrot. Now I found one of two avian
specialists in my state at that time, as I recall, who were board
certified. One was a teacher of board certified vets. She knew her
stuff. But her physical handling was clumsy. So now needed two vets.
One who could handle the delicate birds although not board certified
and one, board certified, who could relish the difficult questions
about treating relatively rare parrots.

Did the vet draw a sample of the fluid for analysis? That's the *first* and
most important step. There are several types of fluid that are produced by
different causes. So, determining the type of fluid might help determine
the cause that's producing the fluid or at least narrow down the
possibilities.

Yes. Nothing found.

Were his serum albumin levels normal? Very important.


We had x-rays and scans


By "scans", do you mean ultrasounds? If so, was his heart scanned
(echocardiogram)? If not I suggest getting an echocardiogram. Heart
disease can produce fluid while the bloodwork is normal.


Ultrasounds.


Did the vet tell you that? Fluid hampers x-rays but it *enhances* sonograms
by producing an "acoustic window". In fact, the cat's body can be
positioned to make the fluid move into different areas to produce better
views.


Yes. Vet told us this.

He shouldn't even consider exploratory surgery without having the fluid
analyzed! *Please* find another vet *ASAP*.

Please find another vet and have the fluid analyzed and order an
echocardiogram. While the vet is drawing fluid for analysis, he can remove
most of the fluid which will make your cat much more comfortable.

Vet said he is unable to remove the fluid.


If you need help locating a board-certified veterinary internist in your
area, please go to: http://www.acvim.org/Kittleson/search.htm and do a
search for an internal medicine Diplomate/Specialist in your area. American
College of Veterinary Internal Medicine Diplomates are about the best there
is.


I'm in the UK.

No More Retail wrote:
I see scans mentioned but not what Did they do an ultra sound since
nothing could be seen because of the fluid or nothing was seen on the x-ray
I might be time for another x-ray with a little more slow paced tech
getting in all the angles. I won't say anything about money but is there
a animal surgical center in your area It might be in the cats' best
interest to take him to him there where more than one vet can take a look
and they usually have the proper equipment to do a diagnoses

I am assuming the cat's stool is ok the abdomen is not sore to the touch or
the cat is pain when moving

I'm in the UK so I dont think theres any such thing as animal surgical
centres. Basically, its just vets.